LaurelHeio
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Description vs. Action
The other day I was talking to my brilliant guy friend Spencer as he read over my latest attempt at writing. It was a first draft, not really edited
yet. I have had a bad habit of setting up a scene (it seems like) forever and having almost nothing happen, so I kept description at a minimum. When I
asked for feedback, he said that he would have liked more description. Of course.
Where do you draw the line? When do you know that you have enough without boring the reader? How do you add description naturally and still have
enough to go by?
(Bonus question: He also said he felt it should have read darker. I, personally, am a pretty up-beat person, and don't particularly care for reading
something that'll depress me. But that could be just me. Who out there would rather get a chill then be comfortable?)
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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itzrissa2u
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Well, it depends on the book. Mine is kind of informal, but when it came time to write a dark scene I really had to work to make it match and not turn
it into something flippant. With help from people here and another board I think it turned out pretty well.
Not every book has to have a dark scene, but there should be conflict.
I hate description. I just want to know the story when I read. You can tell that when it comes to my writing. I don't tend to add enough description.
So it is something I focus on and try to make myself fix. How do I know when it is too much? Um, well, when my crit partners tell me it is full of
purple prose. 
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LaurelHeio
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Crit partner, I need one of those. All I have are my brother, who always says "uh, well, that's good" and my dad, who reads it and then asks me if I
have something better to do.
I think I'd rather have believable conflict then a dark scene which may or may not seem realistic. That might work?
I found a story I wrote back when I was like, 6, and there was an "evil" scene that just seemed really cute. At least me of the past tried...
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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Melanie
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"Dark" is in the eye of the beholder. I don't think you should change your story based on the opinions of one person. Is the theme of your book dark?
If you're upbeat, writing about upbeat stuff, I'm not sure how you make it darker.
How much description to put in? Tough one.
I think the most important thing is to weave description into the action and dialogue. No info dumps, which includes setting the scene. In my opinion,
chapters or whole short stories should jump right into something going on. I'm not going to care if it was a dark and rainy night if everyone is
asleep, ya know what I mean?
Melanie 
"Go forth boldly in the direction of your dreams." Thoreau
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Going Forth Boldly -- The Chronicle of Becoming a Professional Fiction Writer
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Nancy G.
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I'll tell you who likes 'dark'. Glimmertrain. If you come up with a really depressing story, submit it to them. They pay good for depression.
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LaurelHeio
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The theme isn't dark, it's mildly apocalyptic...  It's not dark. But
if I need dark, my outrageously happy friend's stories make you want to die.
Soo.. I'm just gonna keep writing it action-y with a little bit of description laced in. And hopefully it'll turn out well. 
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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LaurelHeio
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Glimmertrain.. I'll tell my friend Delaney about that...
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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Theresa
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Yeah, I hope, my short stories are dark enough for Glimmertrain ... submitted three stories to them in January.
As to the question: I try to use as little description as possible as I hate reading descriptions myself. If I need to describe something, I'll try to
mingle it with the story. So, e. g., if I want to tell my readers that the plains are almost bare, more like a desert, I let them look desperately for
food and water for days.
Love,
Theresa
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Michy
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One of the biggest mistakes I've seen newbie writers do when trying to avoid too much description is telling the story in the dialogue.
If you ever find your characters are saying things in the dialogue JUST so you can tell something you want the reader to know to the reader, stop it
and rewrite the scene.
Your characters are the story - they live the story - they shouldn't tell the story. That's your job.
Love and stuff,
Michy
~~Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations~~
Do just once what others say you can't do, and you will never pay attention to their limitations again." James R. Cook
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LaurelHeio
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Don't use dialogue to replace description. And don't put too much description in. But still, have description.
Anyone else think writing is hard? 
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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Theresa
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Writing is not hard, it's fun! Granted, it might be tedious from time to time if you try to keep your own deadlines and stay up half of the night
because you are still 2k words short of the next mark ... and then, the next
morning, you read through it and notice that you maybe should do research BEFORE writing ... and spend half of the day doing the necessary research
and rewriting the scene
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Michy
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I agree that it's fun, but I do think that writing well IS hard. It's not something that just flows out of us simply because we have talent. Good
writing takes work and dedication and a lot of emotional strain too. It's worth the money we will/might eventually make from it, because it's a
process that not just anyone can do.
I mean, I'm not saying we should have to struggle for it... but it's not 'easy'.
For three weeks after I finished my book, What Brothers Do, I literally mourned the death of one character as though she were just as real as my
sister or best friend. When one of my characters had a bad scene in which he lost control of himself, I had to walk away from the book that night and
lay in Ryan's arms for several hours sobbing like a little kid over it. He finds it all amusing, but he doesn't make fun of me either - I really
appreciate that.
Lynn talks with me about my characters like they are real people. Ryan will ask me, "How is Turner doing today?" Turner being one of my characters.
These people, these characters, because a huge part of my life, and I grieve every time I have to walk away from them. Maybe that's why some authors
love doing sequels - they don't ever have to walk away from a character they love.
And then there is the issue of having to edit things you really love out of a story because in your heart, you know it isn't what's best for the
story. I cut out a fantastic sex scene with Brent and Jackie each cities away from each other both in the tub.... it was really good. Unfortunately, I
realized it did absolutely nothing to further the story at that point, was gratuitous, and so I removed it - I did, however, save it, in hopes I will
have a story that needs a good scene like that - it was fantastic. It hurt to cut it, but it was the right thing for the whole book.
These things ARE hard - not difficult, but hard - and writing is not easy!
It IS, however, sooooooo worth it!
Love and stuff,
Michy
~~Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations~~
Do just once what others say you can't do, and you will never pay attention to their limitations again." James R. Cook
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Theresa
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Ok, Michy, you are right that writing can be hard work, too. But it's a kind of work that's fun to me so I don't really see it as work. And believe
me, I, too, have been sitting crying over my own story ... or bursting in laughter.
And yes, writing is definitely worth good money and appreciation because not everyone can do it!
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LaurelHeio
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Writing IS fun, it's what I love to do. The whole money thing is just another plus.
But what I guess I mean is I become attached to everything I write, even the long-winded descriptions. So cutting pieces out is hard for me to do.
Writing dark is just becoming more ominous as I realize that yeah, I cry and laugh over my characters, so if I were to write dark how much harder
would that make it??
The world is a beautiful place to be born into if you don't mind some people dying all the time or maybe only starving some of the time which isn't
half so bad if it isn't you.
- Laurence Ferlinghetti
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Michy
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Laurel, it makes it a lot harder.
I have literally sat at my keyboard with tears streaming down my face so hard I can barely see because of something that is happening in the story -
and I've literally scared myself to the point I can't sleep.
It's NOT easy.... but man what a ride...
Love and stuff,
Michy
~~Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations~~
Do just once what others say you can't do, and you will never pay attention to their limitations again." James R. Cook
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Gongchime
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My last name is Turner. Is he good or bad?
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sharkbytes
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"And then there is the issue of having to edit things you really love out of a story because in your heart, you know it isn't what's best for the
story."
I have a one page definition of "cache" at the opening of North Country Cache. Trouble is, I wrote it long before the pages were formatted and it was
1 1/2 pages long. Both editors and the printer said that extra half page had to go. How that hurt! I really liked every bit of that essay. I even
dropped the name Colin Fletcher (hiking guru of the 20th century), and told a mini-story. But it had to go. I got that on to one page, but it was
HARD!
When I was on a deadline for the book I made myself write every day, and it was HARD. I wanted to re-write and tweak and agonize over every chapter
till it was "perfect," and I couldn't. That was HARD. And one of the editors rarely agreed with my definition of perfect, either (HA!)
For me, the discipline is hard, sometimes getting the kernel of an idea is hard, but once the words begin to flow, then it's better.
Often, if I let something sit for a few days and then go back and read it, I can see if it has the description/action balance. If I find it boring, I
know a independent reader will too.
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Michy
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He's your basic 'good guy' who gets a bad break, then gets a good break and blows it, and then learns what's really important and makes his own
breaks.
It's a good story....
Love and stuff,
Michy
~~Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations~~
Do just once what others say you can't do, and you will never pay attention to their limitations again." James R. Cook
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Gongchime
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Hmmm... sounds familiar.
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Reprobate
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I think I cut a good mix between description, dialogue and action in Peccadillo. I get both comments by reviewers about 'too much description' and
'not enough description'. Most people are positive, though.
Description slows down the pace of the narrative though - I have one chapter that has a lot of description, but it is in action - someone visiting the
house of the protagonist to 'fetch some thing', using the opportunity to study her house to get to know her better. So you get a room by room
description that I wonder might be too much. Maybe I should post it in the crit section...
rep·ro·bate
n.
A morally unprincipled person.
One who is predestined to damnation.
adj.
Morally unprincipled; shameless.
Rejected by [fill in the supreme being of your choice] and without hope of salvation.
"Beware the lollipop of mediocrity! Lick it once and you'll suck forever..."
Calvin: "I used to hate writing assignments, but now I enjoy them. I realized that the purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure poor
reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog!" - Calvin and Hobbes.
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Don't make me go all Ninja on yo ass! 
